U.S. Department of State Daily Press Briefing, 01-02-21

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From: The Department of State Foreign Affairs Network (DOSFAN) at <http://www.state.gov>

Richard Boucher, Spokesman

Washington, DC

February 21, 2001

INDEX:

MEPN
1-2       Powell Meeting with Nabil Shaath
2         Next Steps
2         Tax Transfer of Revenues
2-3       Secretary's Schedule/Agenda
IRAQ
3-6       Reported Chinese Cooperation with Iraqis
6,11      A/S Welch Trip
6         A/S Walker's Meetings
6-9,11    Discussions of US Policy
10-11     Secretary's Meeting with Chinese Ambassador
DEPARTMENT
12-13     Hanssen with Office of Foreign Missions
13        Allegations of Espionage
14        Russian Involvement
15        FBI Investigation
16        Clearance
17        Other Liaison Offices
13,17     Responsibilities of OFM
17-18     Contacts with Other Missions
ECUADOR
16        Senators in Ecuador
16        Money for Plan Colombia
RUSSIA
16-17     European Missile Defense
18        Secretary's Meeting with Ivanov
JAPAN
18-19     Investigation into Submarine Accident
19        US Relationship with Japan

MR. BOUCHER: Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. It's a pleasure to be here. I don't have any statements for you today, so I'd be glad to take your questions.

Mr. Schweid.

Q: Sure. Mr. Shaath of the PLO has held forth at CSIS today, and he did say that he had asked Powell, Secretary Powell, to do what he could to make sure at least that the Palestinians get the collected taxes, the duties, that have been withheld. Of course he called it a state of siege.

Can you go into that a little bit? Is that one of the Secretary's goals and -- whatever?

MR. BOUCHER: That was one of the issues that was discussed. The Secretary met yesterday with Nabil Shaath to discuss his upcoming trip and the situation in the region. After the meeting with the Secretary, Nabil Shaath had further meetings with Assistant Secretary Walker of the Bureau of Near East Affairs.

The discussion covered a variety of topics, including the issues of violence, the need to stop the violence, the need to reestablish trust and confidence so that people can have confidence as they go about their daily lives, and the economic situation, as well as the need to look forward to a path to pursue peace.

Obviously those issues will be discussed further during the Secretary's trip, but I think we've made quite clear to you that we do believe that the economic pressure on the Palestinians needs to be relieved and that the tax payments in particular need to be made, need to be transferred over, because the Palestinian Authority needs the money to support its operations.

Q: Can you just -- was that in both meetings yesterday or was that just in the Walker meeting? When you said these issues were discussed --

MR. BOUCHER: Those discussions -- what I'm describing actually is the Secretary's discussion. The meeting with Assistant Secretary Walker covered the same topics but in more detail in some ways.

Q: Does about 50 million sound correct?

MR. BOUCHER: I don't know the numbers, actually.

Q: On a larger general sense, and freely translating here, Mr. Shaath speaks of -- you know, refers obviously to the Israeli Government not being formed yet, the US trying to decide on its role. Is the Secretary -- and maybe you've done this yesterday, I don't know -- but is the Secretary going there with any large expectations that he can get the negotiations going again, or is that analysis correct, a few things have to happen before the situation is clear enough to move?

MR. BOUCHER: I think we have said, ever since the Israeli election, that it would be hard to talk about next steps until there was an Israeli Government that was prepared to talk about its next steps. I would say that the Secretary is going to hear from the parties to talk to them about immediate issues like violence, like security, like the economic issues, and to say what he said to you all, and that is that he intends to remain involved and engaged in this. This Administration, including the President as necessary, are prepared to be engaged.

But obviously how we are engaged and what the next steps are will depend on what the parties are prepared to do, and what the parties are prepared to do with each other. And that probably won't be clear until after the Israelis have a government. So he will discuss those issues certainly during the trip, but I wouldn't expect him to come out with -- he is not taking a plan. I wouldn't expect him to come back with a plan.

Q: On the same theme, when was the last time that the Department brought up this tax transfer problem with the Israelis? And when you say you think the Israelis should make the transfer, does this mean you disagree with the Israeli view that violence should stop first?

MR. BOUCHER: First of all, I'm not sure that's -- well, I would leave it to the Israelis to characterize their views, let's put it that way.

This is a point we have made frequently, and I think fairly often to the Israelis. The last time we made it could have been today or yesterday or the day before. It's something that I think is fairly well known. Certainly the Secretary, when he met with Sharon's advisors, made the point about the need to transfer tax revenues. Our Ambassador in Israel has made the point over time as well. So we think this is an important issue, and one that bears repeating.

Q: Can you give us any rundown on, if you are allowed to, on what the program is, who the Secretary is going to be meeting with? And is this considered a get-acquainted trip, or do you think there will be some actual substance?

MR. BOUCHER: I don't have a full schedule for you at this point. He will be meeting with leaders of various kinds in various places. He will expect to see the top leaders in the places that we are visiting. We have given you, I think, a list of the locations that the Secretary will be traveling to. In addition, we have said that he will be seeing Foreign Minister Ivanov in Cairo, and meeting with allies in Brussels where Lord Robertson has called and invited NATO foreign ministers to come to a meeting.

In terms of characterizing the trip, it is a substantive trip in that the discussions will be serious and substantive discussions of policy issues as we go along. It's not just hi, how are you, good to meet you.

Q: On Iraq, what can you say about widespread reports that there were Chinese in Iraq helping to build an optical fiber system that apparently was the precipitous for the attack?

MR. BOUCHER: I think I would say two things. I think the Pentagon has made clear that the attacks were due to the fact that the Iraqis have been increasingly and repeatedly conducting -- attempting artillery missile attacks on coalition aircraft since December 2000, and that our strikes were in reaction to that. They were in an effort, as we always do, to protect our aircraft and our airmen in this case.

In terms of the question of Chinese cooperation with Iraq or Chinese activities with Iraq, we have raised with China our specific concerns about reports of fiber optic cables and telecommunications projects in Iraq. We have these reports about work that was going on, reported to be going on, outside of the sanctions regime, and we have raised these with the Chinese, including during an early January trip by David Welch, our Assistant Secretary for International Organization Affairs, who went to Beijing and raised them there.

We have told the Chinese that we insist on full implementation of all relevant UN resolutions. Enforcing the sanctions regime and minimizing Saddam's threat is a vital interest of ours and one which we share with the other people in the region and the Perm 5. We have committed a lot of effort to that over the past decade, and we'll continue to raise it.

I think we told you when Secretary Powell met with the Permanent 5 ambassadors in New York he stressed the importance of the integrity of the sanctions, of upholding the integrity of sanctions and how important it was for the Perm 5 to do that. And so we have raised these specific reports with the Chinese, and we would expect a response.

Q: Well, are you saying -- by saying that, are you saying that the Chinese were there? And, if so, were the Chinese breaking the sanctions?

MR. BOUCHER: No, I'm not saying the Chinese were there.

Q: You don't know if they were there?

MR. BOUCHER: I'm not saying the Chinese were there. I am saying that -- well, we have reports of Chinese in Iraq working on optical fiber and telecommunications projects, and we raised those reports with the Chinese as a matter of compliance with the UN resolutions, and we stressed again to the Chinese how important maintaining the integrity of those sanctions is.

Q: You said they were outside the sanctions.

MR. BOUCHER: That's what I said.

Q: So if the reports are correct, they are a violation of the sanctions? You're checking a report.

MR. BOUCHER: Yeah, we're checking the reports. We've asked the Chinese about these reports, and we expect a response from them. The reports are that this activity is --

Q: But it's illegal under the sanctions regime, isn't it, if true?

MR. BOUCHER: The reports we have say that this is outside the sanctions. I mean --

Q: Richard, can you say something about what kind of reports you're talking about? Are you talking about news reports, which you often deride as notoriously unreliable until you've actually checked them out, or are you talking about intelligence reports, which we deride as notoriously unreliable unless we can confirm them? (Laughter.)

MR. BOUCHER: I would talk about various reports.

Q: Well, but can you --

MR. BOUCHER: Various kinds of reports.

Q: Are they credible reports?

MR. BOUCHER: I can't go farther than that.

Q: I mean, you can't say credible?

MR. BOUCHER: I can't go farther than that.

Q: Richard, do you know whether the UN Sanctions Committee ever authorized any payment to the Chinese, or a Chinese company or the Chinese Government, in return for these telecommunications -- work on this telecommunication project?

MR. BOUCHER: I don't know if the Sanctions Committee has ever authorized any work on telecommunications projects, but I do know that the reports that we have and the reports that we raised were about activities that were not approved by the UN Sanctions Committee.

Can we let somebody else ask a question?

Q: Okay, a few questions. These reports -- you said that you've raised them with the Chinese. Does the US believe that these reports are credible? Do you believe that there is -- is there any doubt in your mind that the Chinese have been helping the Iraqis with their fiber optic cables?

MR. BOUCHER: I am constrained in what I can say about these reports and concerns that we have about this because I'm not in a position to describe them to you in any specificity or detail, as you have found out through your series of questions. We have various kinds of reports on these subjects, and I am not in a position to describe them to you.

So I think all I can say on that is we don't raise these things lightly with other governments. We raise information that we have good reason to believe is true, and we ask governments to explain and respond to those. And in this case, we have done this with the Chinese.

Q: Okay then, to follow up, yesterday, I believe, the Chinese Government did respond and denied the fact that they have been helping the Iraqis. Are you looking for a response beyond that?

MR. BOUCHER: I would say we are still awaiting a detailed response to the reports that we raised.

Q: Okay. And then finally, do you think --

MR. BOUCHER: And actually, the Secretary made that point this morning to the Chinese Ambassador, who was in to present his credentials. And it was a normal presentation, discussion of the general relationship, but the Secretary took the opportunity also to raise our concerns about Chinese workers in Iraq, and in the context of compliance with the UN Security Council resolutions. And he mentioned the approach that we had made in January to raise these specific concerns and said we were looking for a response.

Q: Finally, do you have any reason to believe that the Iraqis are helped - - or excuse me, the Chinese are helping the Iraqis elsewhere in a manner that would be outside the sanctions?

MR. BOUCHER: That's a pretty broad question that I don't think I can answer at this point.

Q: How is it broad? I'm just saying, are the --

MR. BOUCHER: Are they doing -- are the Chinese doing anything else in Iraq that is not covered by the Sanctions Committee? That is a very broad question, I'm sorry.

Q: Well, why -- I don't understand --

MR. BOUCHER: I just don't have the answer for you right now.

Q: Are you saying that you don't have the answer because it doesn't -- you haven't looked at that, or because you don't want to share it?

MR. BOUCHER: Because I haven't done the comprehensive search on that. I may be able to, but I'm not sure I can.

Q: Didn't Defense officials say, though, that we planned the timing of the air strikes to avoid hitting Chinese workers?

MR. BOUCHER: I don't know. There were anonymous officials quoted in the newspaper. Would you like to identify your sources?

Q: I don't have -- no, I read the same reports. But I think they cited Defense officials saying that.

MR. BOUCHER: Well, in that case, you can go ask the Defense officials if you happen to know who they are; I don't.

Q: I don't. But why would Defense officials have these reports apparently confirmed, or using these reports to time air strikes if the government --

MR. BOUCHER: I think you are asking me questions I can't answer there. I really don't think I could talk about the sources that reporters have. That's up to reporters, if they should wish.

Q: Richard, one other on this. With the understanding that you have of these reports and the presumption that some aspect of them are true, these projects, were they understood to be projects to reconstruct --

MR. BOUCHER: I didn't say that some aspects aren't true. I just said what we had raised -- what we knew and what we had raised.

Q: Are these projects purported to be ones to reconstruct the Iraqi telephone system and communication system, and considered to be dual-use, that the Iraqis may -- or are also using it for military purposes?

MR. BOUCHER: Again, I can't go into any more detail with you about the kind of reports we have. But working on telecommunications and fiber optics projects is because you are constructing a communications system or reconstructing a communications system. Obviously whatever the intended recipient of that communication system, having those better communications in the country, obviously it contributes to their ability to pass information. I think I have to leave it at that. That is sort of the obvious, but I can't go beyond the obvious on that.

Q: When you first spoke about this, you used the qualifier, "reports of Chinese workers," and then later you said -- and I believe I'm quoting you directly -- that "Secretary Powell raised concerns about Chinese workers in Iraq," in effect dropping the qualifier. Which way do you prefer it?

MR. BOUCHER: I don't pretty much care. (Laughter.)

Q: Well, if you don't -- okay. Can you -- two things. No, I've got two things on this, if I can, please. One, Mr. Welch's visit was only on this, or were there other issues that he was going over there to address?

And, secondly, can you talk a little bit about the meetings that are going to go on either today or tomorrow between the US and Britain here about revised -- well, I don't want to say revised -- but, you know, reenergizing the sanctions, and if the Secretary is hoping that something can come out of these meetings that he can bring with him on his trip to present to whoever he meets?

MR. BOUCHER: Okay. The trip by Assistant Secretary Welch, I would have to check on the other things. We regularly carry out consultations with other members of the Security Council, and through our Assistant Secretary discuss sort of Security Council business.

Q: But you don't know if he was dispatched --

MR. BOUCHER: I would put the trip in that context. I am sure that that other stuff was discussed. I'll check and see if we want to say that he was sent -- whether the trip at this time was specifically to raise these issues or whether it was raised during a consultation on broader issues.

On the second part, on the meetings with the British, Assistant Secretary Walker is meeting today in the Department with his United Kingdom counterpart, Alan Goulty. The meeting is part of our ongoing consultations with the British on our policies in the region. That means Iraq, other issues in the region as well.

Secretary Powell and Foreign Secretary Cook, I think, discussed this meeting with you about two weeks ago. So it's not directly related to the air strikes of February 16th. Certainly this is the opportunity that they described in their press conference to discuss and to coordinate our approaches towards Iraq, our effort to make sure that the UN rules -- that the sanctions achieve their original purpose, which was to keep Iraq from getting weapons and the money to acquire them and the means to acquire them. And this is similar to the discussions that we will have with others during the course of the trip.

So we've been discussing the issue of Iraq and sanctions and the threat that Iraq poses to the people of the region with a variety of visitors to Washington. This is more detailed discussions with the British on that, and then the Secretary will continue those discussions with people in the region who are threatened during the course of his trip.

Q: But is he hoping that out of this meeting -- you said it was just today, not tomorrow? Whenever it is, but he is hoping that --

MR. BOUCHER: I think it's just today. I'm not exactly sure how long it will last.

Q: Okay. But is the Secretary hoping that ideas will be raised or come out of these meetings that he can bring with him then on the trip to say, here, look, here's something that we think we can work with; can you?

MR. BOUCHER: I think I would describe it as a process of working with friends and allies as we develop the policy in more and more detail. So he has had discussions with a variety of foreign ministers who have been to Washington. We've seen the Jordanians, the Tunisians, the British, the Germans, the Canadians. I can't remember them all. I think it's up to 30 or more already foreign ministers that the Secretary has talked to. Many of those discussions involve the approach to Iraq and how we would address the issues involving Iraq. That is a process of discussion with allies and friends as we develop the policy in more and more detail.

The Secretary has described to you his general approach. We'll discuss it more with the British today in somewhat more detail, and then we'll continue to proceed in discussions with the people in the region. But I think the Secretary has made quite clear their role is very, very important because they are the ones that Iraq is threatening.

Q: I'm not trying to suggest that you're going to go out there and dictate and say, look, this is what we're going to do whether you like it or not. I'm just trying to get --

MR. BOUCHER: I'm not trying to suggest that, either.

Q: I know. But is he going to be going there -- is he hoping to be going there with some new ideas coming out of these meetings?

MR. BOUCHER: I wouldn't put it that way, either. I would say that he's out there to continue the discussions, some of which we've started already with our friends and allies, about how to make sure the sanctions achieve that purpose of keeping Iraq from getting weapons and the means to acquire them.

Q: You seem to be suggesting at least that you are developing some details on how you are going to do what you hope to do, which is to stop military technology imports while easing up on food and medicine. The Saudis today criticized the raid. Do you think you'll have enough to persuade them that you do have an Iraq policy that has a chance of working? I mean, have you got enough detail to at least, you know, placate them temporarily.

MR. BOUCHER: I'm sorry, I think we've made a -- that there was a bit of a skip in the question there somehow. We were talking about sanctions regime, and then you said the Saudis criticized the raid?

Q: Yeah, well, those are part of the same thing. Why are they criticizing --

MR. BOUCHER: Did they criticize the sanctions regime?

Q: No, they --

MR. BOUCHER: Did they criticized the effort to keep Iraq from getting weapons? Okay, I think I'm being asked apples and oranges here.

Q: Okay, let me put it this way. You say you're working on -- do you now have some details beyond what you've told us in public with the broad outlines of your Iraq strategy?

MR. BOUCHER: I would say that -- not to announce. Yes, the Secretary has been discussing these issues, and we're discussing them further with the British, bringing more definition. I think we've made clear what the goals are and what the approaches are. But we've also made clear that the Secretary looks forward to discussing this in more detail, not only with people who visit Washington but the people that he will visit as he travels.

Shall we go to China? This gentleman has something.

Q: Following last Friday's air strikes against Iraq, the Government of Turkey complained to the United States over what it called a lack of dialogue on Iraq policies. Any comment on that? And, secondly, are you disturbed by Turkey's moves for rapprochement with Saddam? Do you see anything that would be against -- that would be outside the sanctions regime?

MR. BOUCHER: I think we've talked about specifics when asked about various things that Turkey is doing or not doing in that regard. I think our cooperation with Turkey remains very, very good vis-�-vis this. And Turkey is obviously an important partner in this process and one of the countries that has a reason to be most concerned about Iraq's capabilities.

We do regularly consult with other governments, whether it's Turkey or the Gulf states or other allies, about Iraq policy. I think I've heard a number of foreign ministers address various issues as they've been here. We haven't seen the Turkish foreign minister yet, but I think most of the people that address the question recognize the right of the United States to defend its airplanes and its airmen, so I'm not sure that there's much of a quibble on that point.

So I think I'll leave it at that. We talk to our allies. We will continue to talk to our allies.

Q: But does that go for -- I mean, this has not just caused problems in Turkey but other NATO countries as well. In Italy, the government has also come out against -- the French obviously have -- so has -- I mean, it has caused a shake-up in the Polish Government. A senior aide resigned after supporting them.

Are you at all concerned, especially with Poland, your newest NATO ally, that the reaction is coming so fast and furious, with the one exception of Germany?

MR. BOUCHER: I would leave you with the characterization the Secretary gave yesterday to what he had heard from people.

Q: When you were talking about the integrity with the sanctions with the Chinese, why is the (inaudible) way of the United States? If I am correct, or if I am wrong, I think the United Nations has to give the permission for attacking Iraq. Why the United States --

MR. BOUCHER: You're wrong.

Q: It's incorrect?

MR. BOUCHER: Yes.

Q: Can you just tell us a little bit more about the meeting with the new Chinese Ambassador this morning? You mentioned they had talked about broader issues than the Iraq -- the potential Iraq help.

When he left the building this morning, he gave a big thumbs-up and a smile and said that everything -- that his meeting went very well, and they discussed ways to move forward, the Sino-US relationship.

MR. BOUCHER: I don't have a detailed readout. The Secretary has been seeing ambassadors who are presenting their credentials, and for the most part these are general discussions of relationships and ways of which we can move forward. My understanding is that is the general tenor of this discussion with the Chinese this morning.

Q: But did the human rights situation --

MR. BOUCHER: This is not a detailed substantive meeting.

Q: Did the Human Rights Report that will be coming out either Friday or Monday come up?

MR. BOUCHER: Not that I know of. I'll have to double-check.

Q: But, Richard, same subject. The Secretary met with the outgoing Chinese Ambassador about three or four days after he was sworn in, and the tone of that meeting was decidedly negative. Are you saying the tone today was different with the incoming Chinese Ambassador?

MR. BOUCHER: I think I am saying that this was a different sort of meeting. The Secretary made clear in his meeting with the outgoing Chinese Ambassador what were the fundamentals of the relationship; and used the opportunity to convey that to him, and through him back to Beijing, because he was returning there.

Today, he had quite a normal, different kind of meeting that was a presentation of credentials. But the Secretary also took this occasion to convey a message, and the message was that we are concerned about the issue of Chinese workers in Iraq; we see this in the context of maintaining the integrity of the Security Council resolutions and the integrity of UN sanctions; and that we expected a response to our demarche that we had made in January on this subject.

Q: Richard, did Secretary Powell present the new Chinese Ambassador with the evidence, or is he just sort of talking about it in general?

MR. BOUCHER: Again, this was not that kind of meeting. We had a detailed meeting on this subject in January when David Welch went out, and the Secretary referred back to that meeting.

Q: And during David Welch's meeting, he brought presumably photographs, or whatever evidence -- did he present the Chinese with evidence that they could put in their hands?

MR. BOUCHER: He presented the Chinese with information that described our concerns and described the activities about which we had had reports and about which we were concerned.

Q: In your reports, was there a time scale for how long these Chinese workers have been there?

MR. BOUCHER: No. I mean, I can't answer that question. No, I don't have an answer for you on that question, is the answer. I can't say that.

Q: I've got one more. This morning in their meeting -- first of all, how long was it? And second of all, did he bring up -- did he use the opportunity to say whether the United States would be sponsoring or signing onto a resolution in Geneva?

MR. BOUCHER: There is no decision on that at this point. Again, the meeting was not a detailed and substantive meeting.

Q: Right, I know that. Was it 10, 15 minutes?

MR. BOUCHER: It was 10 minutes, probably.

Q: One more on this. In the meeting this morning, did Secretary Powell suggest to China that it could be violating sanctions in this respect? Was that an issue?

MR. BOUCHER: I stick with my characterization. I don't think I have anything to add to that.

Q: The Prime Minister of Turkey -- (inaudible) -- of Turkey, they said that other than the traditional US way, this time the United States, they didn't inform us of their attack, which you decided one day before the President's approval on this subject.

What was the realism? Is that passing through this information to the Iraqis, or to -- what would be the reason?

MR. BOUCHER: We obviously keep in close touch. We have regular discussions with our allies, with other governments, about the policies that we maintain with regard to Iraq, particularly an ally as close as Turkey where we cooperate in so many ways.

As far as any specific strike, I think as you know, everybody is quite familiar that we have a policy that when we are threatened, we will respond at a time and place of our choosing, and that is what occurred here. So I think they are quite familiar with the policy, the routine, use of force when we think it is necessary.

As far as these specific strikes, we did have more discussions with people after the strikes.

Q: Can you talk about Mr. Hanssen and his time in the building? I'm sure you have a lot of details you could give us on that -- what his specific duties were when he was here, and also --

MR. BOUCHER: Who did he have lunch with the in the cafeteria? (Laughter.)

Q: Something like that. And also, whether or not you can tell us whether the State Department, DS presumably but maybe the IG's office, is doing its own investigation.

MR. BOUCHER: Robert Hanssen was detailed to the Office of Foreign Missions from February 1995 until January 12th of this year. He worked in the Office of Foreign Missions as part of the respective responsibilities that the Department of State and the FBI have under the Foreign Missions Act of 1982. If you look at the act, you'll see that we cooperate in these ways, and both of our roles are specified in the act.

In that capacity, he worked on issues relating to real property and the travel of foreign diplomats in the United States. In the course of his duties, he would have had dealings with many bureaus in the Department, including the Bureau of Intelligence and Research, on matters within the purview of his role at the Office of Foreign Missions.

For those of you who don't know more generally, let me go through what the Office of Foreign Missions does. They ensure equitable treatment for US diplomatic consular missions abroad and their personnel through reciprocity, and that was one of the main reasons why this act established the Office of Foreign Missions in 1982 so that we could obtain reciprocity for our diplomats overseas.

The Office of Foreign Missions regulates activities of foreign missions in the United States, protects the US public from abuses of privileges and immunities by members of foreign missions, and provides service and assistance to the foreign mission community in the United States to assure that appropriate privileges, benefits and services are available on a reciprocal basis.

What else were you asking? In terms of our cooperation, our investigation, I would put it that we are assisting and cooperating with the FBI in its investigations. I'm not aware that we have anything separate going ourselves.

Q: Anything on the laptop today or the (inaudible) --

MR. BOUCHER: Nothing new on those, no.

Q: He was liaison with INR, according to the affidavit.

MR. BOUCHER: For the matter of pertaining to his role at Foreign Missions.

Q: Only for those matters?

MR. BOUCHER: We have a variety of different liaisons with the FBI.

Q: But you realize that all departments of the US Government run as a seamless machine, and I'm just wondering if --

MR. BOUCHER: But are careful not to talk about each other's business.

Q: Exactly. Escaped the notice that the FBI, in particular in the intelligence community in general, has kind of looked down its nose at the State Department for all these security violations. Does anyone find it ironic in this building that the FBI deposited here for five years a guy who turned out to be a spy? Well, allegedly turned out to be a spy?

MR. BOUCHER: I think it's in Annie Hall where the guy says, "Oh, irony. We don't have that here." (Laughter.)

No, not at all, Matt. I think we all are, first of all, dismayed and disappointed that any American can be alleged to have carried out such activities, particularly somebody who enjoyed the public's trust, in the way that all of us who work in government do. We have the admiration for the people who carried out this investigation and managed to identify, according to their affidavits -- I guess I have to put reportedly identify or allegedly identify someone who was spying on behalf of a foreign power against us. And that's -- so, you know, I think that's a common feeling to people around here is that these things are extremely regrettable and very disappointing in terms of those of us who do the public's business who do enjoy the public's trust of finding that somebody has not been able to live up to that.

Q: Richard, a question on this as well. The FBI were not able to round up any Russians after the deposit of the latest packet of information that he made. They have said, however, I believe yesterday, that they believe they have identified several people at the embassy who had contact with him.

Are you aware of any attempts to PNG any Russian diplomats?

MR. BOUCHER: I don't have anything like that at this time.

Q: Do you know if it's being looked at?

MR. BOUCHER: Obviously that is something that would be looked at in due course, but I'll leave that where it is for the moment.

Q: Richard, as I understand, there is some senior officials who don't have access, full access, to the INR Bureau because of a lack of need to know and so forth. Do you know if Hanssen had full access to that Bureau?

MR. BOUCHER: I guess without trying to get into Mr. Hanssen particularly since those issues would be under investigation, and I have to leave any matters under investigation to the FBI at this moment, I would say that almost nobody would have full access to everything in INR. The way that security is handled is people who need to know specific things are allowed to know those things, and the people who don't need to know are not. So there are very few people who would have a justified need to know everything that's available in INR.

Q: Is that report that Betsy just mentioned, the FBI saying that they believe they've identified a few Chinese diplomats with which Hanssen --

MR. BOUCHER: Russian.

Q: Oh, God, no. Russian diplomats. There I go, starting another scandal. Russian diplomats with which Hanssen had contact. Is that something about which the State Department is aware of?

MR. BOUCHER: We've read the same affidavits as you have.

Q: Right, but I mean, have you --

MR. BOUCHER: Our security people have been working with the FBI on these matters, so I'll just leave it at that.

Q: Do you -- at this point, are you aware of any link between him and the bug that was discovered in the 7th floor conference room?

MR. BOUCHER: I think if you saw what the Director of the FBI said yesterday, he said that the complaint that they were presenting at this time does not allege any compromises by him at the State Department. Obviously the interviews that the FBI is conducting with people in this building, and I'm sure elsewhere, continue. And if any information is developed, we probably won't tell you about it. (Laughter.)

But I think that we will defer to the FBI for anything to say on that at the appropriate time, but they have said at this stage what their observation is at this moment.

Q: Is there any link between him and the lost laptops in this building?

MR. BOUCHER: Same answer, whether you ask me about the bug or the laptops or the man in the tweed coat or any of the other adventures we have had in the last few years.

Q: I know people that are here -- the investigators that are here -- are they only from the FBI? Do you know how many there are, and how long they intend to -- I mean, obviously until they are finished. But do you expect them to be back again tomorrow or Friday?

MR. BOUCHER: I don't know how many people are here. They obviously conduct their investigation as they decide it best, and we work with them and help them with that. They, I believe, started their interviews yesterday; I expect they will continue as long as they deem necessary. They are interviewing State Department employees who worked with Mr. Hanssen while he was detailed over here.

Q: When he was shifted -- was it last month that he was shifted? Was that because of suspicions?

MR. BOUCHER: He was here until January 12th.

Q: And why was he changed?

MR. BOUCHER: That is a question you would have to ask the FBI.

Q: Okay.

MR. BOUCHER: Another subject?

Q: One more on that. Besides maybe arcane personnel, but who -- could you boot this guy out of here if you wanted to? Or is it an FBI -- do they tell you, this is our guy, we're putting him in, and you don't have anything to say about it?

MR. BOUCHER: The personnel decisions are in the hands of the FBI.

Q: Okay.

MR. BOUCHER: Obviously if it was somebody that for some reason was unacceptable to us, we could make that known. But it is their decision.

Q: Another question related to security. When someone like that from the FBI comes to work here, does DS do its own investigation or does it just accept FBI security clearance?

MR. BOUCHER: He comes with a full FBI clearance. So we don't need to do a separate one.

Q: Richard, can we go back. There is a group of senators in Ecuador discussing the government of the country, about the spillover from Colombia for the border area. My question is, did State Department have a conversation with those senators before the trip to discuss the issue with the Ecuadorian authorities? And that country is still requesting $150 million for the -- to confront what they call the spillover of Plan Colombia in the border area, and the Foreign Minister is coming next week. He is going to meet Secretary Powell.

What is the position of this Government about their request for the -- to confront the spillover of Plan Colombia?

MR. BOUCHER: I don't -- I will have to check and see if we met with a group of senators who are down in Ecuador. We frequently do meet with people before trips like that.

As far as any specific budgetary requests, I think we would have to wait for the budget and see how the budget will affect that. As you know, Plan Colombia has included money for neighboring countries, and the Secretary has spoken in his confirmation hearings and elsewhere of the need to emphasize that aspect, to make sure the plan does adequately cover the whole Andean region.

So we will see, but I don't have any numbers for you until we get to -- probably until we get to the budget. I'm sure the needs of Ecuador and our desire to make sure that they are -- that we do cooperate with them against narcotics, that that will be discussed with the Foreign Minister when he comes. I don't actually remember the exact date. I'll have to check.

Q: What is the US view of the Russian missile defense plan that was presented? Do we think this is a serious proposal, or is it just something attempting to block our own --

MR. BOUCHER: Well, the US view of the Russian missile plan is that we will look at it, that we need to study it in detail, I think, before we can make a realistic assessment of what Russia has in mind.

We would make two general observations. One is that we welcome the fact that Russia recognizes that Europe faces a serious threat from weapons of mass destruction and missile delivery systems, and that Russia believes that defensive systems are necessary for protection and stability.

Obviously we have welcomed questions of cooperation in general, but I would also note that the deployment of a missile defense for Europe would not protect the United States against ballistic missile launches, and so it would not be a substitute for the deployment of a National Missile Defense.

Q: You seem to -- how much detail have you seen on this? Has Secretary -- General Robertson got back to you?

MR. BOUCHER: I'm not sure if we actually have a copy of it yet. What I do know is we haven't had a chance to really look at it in any detail.

Q: Will this be discussed in Cairo in the meeting between Powell and Ivanov?

MR. BOUCHER: I don't know for sure. They will discuss a lot of things. I'm sure missile defense generally, including Europe, would probably come up. But whether this specific proposal comes up or not depends on whether they want to raise it, and after we have looked at it, if we find anything we need to talk about.

Q: Finally. Eighth row back. Back of the bus. On Hanssen, are there more than one FBI liaison persons in the Foreign Missions Bureau, and do you have other ones in INR, for example?

MR. BOUCHER: There are various FBI people that work with us around this building, so, yes, we have different channels for dealing with the FBI. I don't know if they have more than one person in the Office of Foreign Missions. I do note that the FBI has a statutory responsibility under the Foreign Missions Act to help us carry out the act.

Q: Do you have -- a couple of other small questions on this. Does the Office of Foreign Missions also include contact on UN -- diplomats to the UN, or is it limited to the embassies?

MR. BOUCHER: I will have to double-check that because I think there is a difference in terms of the UN diplomats, in terms of accreditation, because they are accredited to the United Nations.

Q: Right.

MR. BOUCHER: But I think I'm pretty sure, when it comes to facilities, that we do that. I will have to double-check on that.

Q: And my final question on this is, did Hanssen have any foreign trips or did he have anything to do with liaison with other countries, and have those countries been notified or discussed -- his arrest been discussed with any foreign missions at this point?

MR. BOUCHER: I don't know what contacts he might have had with foreign missions directly in the course of his job. I don't know of any discussions, but as far as what the contacts were and how those were conducted, that would be in the purview of the FBI investigators. And I believe the FBI had something to say yesterday in the Director's statement and the affidavit about the fact that he was not authorized to have certain kinds of contacts in any way.

Q: This may seem sort of off the wall, but is there any reason to believe that Hanssen may have been spying for other governments beyond the Russians?

MR. BOUCHER: That is the kind of question you can ask the FBI, and they will decide whether it is off the wall or not.

Q: Okay. And then if you could please just sort of lay out for us what is on the agenda with the Ivanov meeting, what the US priorities are to discuss? If you prefer, I can ask this question later in the week.

MR. BOUCHER: I think we would prefer to do that later in the week, or even on the trip.

Q: Okay.

MR. BOUCHER: Obviously the meeting with Foreign Minister Ivanov is the Secretary's first chance to get together with him face to face to discuss, I think, a broad variety of issues in our relationship of bilateral issues, and the larger security and cooperation issues like missile defense in Iraq. And they will be in the Middle East. I am sure they will want to discuss Middle East peace, the situation in Russia, and some of the things that we think about that, particularly with regard to media freedom. Those are the kinds of things that might come up. But what specific issues will come up, I think we would wait to do that during the trip.

Q: I'm sorry -- one related question. Have you made a decision yet on whether to grant former Taiwanese President Lee a visa? And if you -- even if you haven't made a decision, was this something that came up during the lightning ten-minute discussion, meeting, whatever, this morning?

MR. BOUCHER: I don't have a full rundown of all the issues that came up. As far as I know, it was a general discussion. And this one particular issue -- I didn't have any other issues cited to me when I asked people about it.

And as far as any decisions on travel, it would depend if the traveler intended to come. When I have checked on this in the past, there hasn't been any request for a visa.

Q: Are there any plans to send a special envoy to Japan to deal with the Greenville collision?

MR. BOUCHER: That is a suggestion that we are seriously considering. We would hope to make a decision soon, but nothing to announce at this time.

Q: Can you say which kind of special envoy, and is it soon? Is it sometime this week or next week? And what kind of message do you bring to the Japanese?

MR. BOUCHER: Those are all questions that we are seriously considering, and we will get back to you soon.

Q: Yes, but the message -- which kind of message?

MR. BOUCHER: I don't think I want to elaborate on that at this point. Let's wait until we decide whether to do it or not, and then we will tell you what the message is.

Q: Right. Not really changing here, but from the beginning you said the US-Japan relationship has been solid for 50 years, but the way these things has been developed, or has been moving, is sort of messed up. Initially, maybe hurt, maybe didn't release the name of the guest, and then also they didn't tell us that civilian was -- civilians are in control room, even after they said civilian didn't distract them. But yesterday they said well, actually, civilian distract them.

So do you -- can you still say this issue itself discuss really mess up the US-Japan relationship and the relationship is still solid?

MR. BOUCHER: I would be glad to say that the US-Japan relationship is still solid, that we are cooperating very, very closely with the Japanese on this. They have liaison people in Hawaii. Our people investigating this are working very closely with them out there, and these are -- it is very tragic, it is very regrettable. But even in these terrible circumstances, we work very closely with our Japanese allies.

Thank you.

[end}

Released on February 21, 2001

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