Greek Government Press Briefing, 05-04-01

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

Aqhna, 1 Aprilioy 2005

JENOY TYPOY APO TON ANAPLHRWTH KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO

EYAGGELO ANTWNARO

Xairete kai kalo mhna.

Parakalw, tis erwthseis sas.

SPYRAKH: Hqela na rwthsw an einai pragmati non paper, proerxomeno apo thn kybernhsh ayto poy apokalyce xqes to PASOK, se sxesh me th xqesinh ekdhlwsh sto OAKA ``Anoixta Stadia''. An pragmati proerxetai apo kybernhtikh phgh, qa hqela na rwthsw pws sxoliazete thn anafora poy emperiexei sta paidia twn sxoleiwn me eidikes anagkes;

ANTWNAROS: Shmasia exei oti ola ta paidia exoyn th dynatothta na apolaysoyn tis olympiakes egkatastaseis. Kai qa htan idiaitera paradojo nomizw gia thn anqrwpia kai thn eyaisqhsia poy diakrinei -kai prepei na diakrinei- thn koinwnia mas, an den anagnwrizame sta paidia apo ta sxoleia me eidikes anagkes to aytonohto dikaiwma na einai ki ekeina paronta.

SPYRAKH: Den sas rwthsa ayto. Qa hqela mia dieykrinish. Sas rwthsa an proerxetai apo kybernhtikh phgh to non paper poy xqes emfanise to PASOK kai an ayto isxyei, pws sxoliazete thn anafora poy emperiexetai se ayto gia ta paidia twn sxoleiwn me eidikes anagkes poy emfanisthkan sthn ekdhlwsh.

ANTWNAROS: H oysia einai oti oi olympiakes egkatastaseis ligoys molis mhnes meta toys Olympiakoys Agwnes, einai anoixtes, prosbasimes kai prosites se oloys.

ANTWNOPOYLOS: Poios einai o syntakths aytoy toy eggrafoy. Se kapoio shmeio toy eggrafoy aytoy anaferetai oti prepei na dhmioyrghqei h aisqhsh. Dhladh, ti ennoei o syntakths me ayto to qema;

ANTWNAROS: Den gnwrizw. Metraei, opws sas eipa, h oysia toy pragmatos: Den yparxei monon h aisqhsh, alla kai h pepoiqhsh se kaqe Ellhnida kai Ellhna polith oti h kybernhsh exei kanei swsth kai apotelesmatikh proetoimasia gia thn metaolympiakh xrhsh kai ajiopoihsh twn olympiakwn egkatastasewn. Ola ta alla einai xwris oysia.

SIDERHS: Kaqe allo para filologies einai. Eipate oti h koinwnia prepei na deixnei eyaisqhsia. Ma h kybernhsh den edeije thn idia eyaisqhsia me bash ayto to xarti poy eidame. Apla xrhsimopoihse ayta ta paidia ws epikoinwniako swoy kai ws ntekor.

ANTWNAROS: Yparxoyn aithmata para pollwn sxoleiwn poy zhtoyn na toys doqei h dynatothta, meta apo ayth th giorth poy eidan kai th symmetoxh twn paidiwn se ayth thn aqlhtikh ekdhlwsh, na metasxoyn. Ta paidia xarhkan th symmetoxh toys.

MIXAHL: To PASOK sas kataggellei oti, epikaloymeno ayto to shmeiwma, skopimws sthsate ayth th giorth. Ti apantate; Kai malista o k. Aqanasakhs eipe: Sthsate fiesta epikoinwniakh me th symmetoxh aytwn twn sxoleiwn. Afhste to non paper. Apanthste sta osa eipe o Ekproswpos toy PASOK. Poia einai h apanthsh sas;

ANTWNAROS: To PASOK kai oi ekproswpoi toy mporei na lene o,ti qeloyn. Ekeinoi poy afhsan ta panta na ginoyn thn teleytaia stigmh, ekeinoi poy odhghsan ton proypologismo twn Olympiakwn Agwnwn se dysqewrhta ych, ekeinoi poy den eixan kan thn pronoia na teleiwsoyn thn olympiakh diadromh toy Maraqwnioy egkairws, enoxloyntai twra kai malista gia para polloys logoys. Enoxloyntai kyriws, omws, giati h shmerinh kybernhsh apoperatwse ta erga ayta -opws ofeile- kai giati twra h metaolympiakh xrhsh twn ergwn, gia thn opoia prin apo liges ebdomades kathgoreito h shmerinh kybernhsh, ginetai prajh. Ta pragmata einai apla. Den katalabainw kaqoloy ayta ta epixeirhmata ths Antipoliteyshs.

GKOYTZANHS: Xwris na epanalabw ta epixeirhmata ths Antipoliteyshs yparxei ena qema apo th diatypwsh toy eggrafoy. Anaferetai safws oti gia na tonistei h anqrwpinh diastash ths ekdhlwshs na yparxei ena sxoleio me paidia me eidikes anagkes. An den htan etsi diatypwmeno den qa yphrxe problhma.

ANTWNAROS: Den prokeitai se kamia periptwsh na sxoliasw ena eggrafo to opoio den gnwrizw. Sas ejhghsa th qesh ths kybernhshs. Sas ejhghsa, epishs, oti den mporei kaneis na amfisbhtei thn aytonohth paroysia twn paidiwn me eidikes anagkes sth sygkekrimenh ekdhlwsh. Einai mia entelws ratsistikh proseggish ayth.

GKOYTZANHS: To antiqeto, toylaxiston, se o,ti afora emas.

ANTWNAROS: Den anaferomai proswpikws se sas. Synadelfos sas sthn aiqoysa me kalese na apanthsw sto PASOK kai toys ekproswpoys toy.

MIXAHL: Me sygxwreite, epeidh anafereste sthn erwthsh moy qa sas pw to ejhs: Oti to PASOK epikaleitai akribws ayto to eggrafo, legontas oti h kybernhsh prospaqei na kalycei ta epikoinwniaka ths kena. Ayth einai h oysia ths apolitikhs apofashs. Gi ayto sthnei ayth th ``fiesta'' opws eipe o k. Aqanasakhs xqes kai to diabasate.

ANTWNAROS: E! Kai den paei na to leei o k. Aqanasakhs!

MIXAHL: Wraia. Yparxoyn kai alloi poy to lene.

ANTWNAROS: E, kai;

MIXAHL: Me sygxwreite, oxi kai-kai. Oxi ``kai''.

DHMOSIOGRAFOS: So what!

ANTWNAROS: Exw thn entypwsh oti se ayth thn aiqoysa milame ellhnika.

MIXAHL: To ``so what'' entajei. Kat` arxhn poioi einai oi jerokefaloi poy sto Megaro Majimoy, opws egrace o k. Pasalarhs xqes, parasernoyn ton Prwqypoyrgo se aytoy toy eidoys tis epikoinwnies;

ANTWNAROS: Ti lete;

MIXAHL: Egw ti lew; Eseis ti lete.

ANTWNAROS: Qa leme emeis ston Typo ti qa gracei;

MIXAHL: Oxi, lew, poioi einai oi jerokefaloi poy leei o k. Pasalarhs. Den to lew egw.

ANTWNAROS: Rwthste ton k. Pasalarh.

MIXAHL: Yparxoyn, loipon, jerokefaloi sto Megaro Majimoy poy kanoyn mia epikoinwniakh politikh h opoia, ayth th stigmh opws diabazoyme stis efhmerides, dhmioyrgei problhma se polla stelexh sas;

ANTWNAROS: Den prokeitai na sas parakoloyqhsw se ayta poy lete.

MIXAHL: Emena; Ta stelexh sas kai opws grafontai sta dhmosieymata. Egw den lew kati, metaferw ayta poy legontai shmera.

ANTWNAROS: Sas eipa oti kaqenas exei to dikaiwma na grafei ayta poy qelei. As mhn blepoyme gia logoys entypwsiasmoy problhmata ekei poy den yparxoyn.

MIXAHL: Nai, alla den einai etsi ta pragmata epitrecte moy na sas pw. To erwthma loipon einai to ejhs: Shmera diabazoyme polla dhmosieymata oti yparxei megalh dysareskeia se merida kybernhtikwn stelexwn ypoyrgwn kai boyleytwn gia ton tropo poy ginetai h epikoinwniakh politikh ths kybernhshs. Epikalesthka prohgoymenws kai epwnymes epishmanseis, opws kai toy Dieyqynth ths ``Kaqhmerinhs'' toy k. Aggelopoyloy xqes, kai qelw, loipon, na sas rwthsw ean pisteyete eseis oti aytes oi diamartyries einai basimes h oxi;

ANTWNAROS: H kybernhsh synolika kanei poly kala th doyleia ths.

SIDERHS: Ayto htan prwtapriliatiko asteio;

ANTWNAROS: Den nomizw oti dexqhka akomh kapoia prwtapriliatikh erwthsh.

MIXAHL: Oxi, alla oi apanthseis mporei na exoyn prwtapriliatiko xrwma.

ANTWNAROS: Ejartatai apo thn aisqhsh toy xioymor kaqenos.

POYLIDOY: Epeidh, opws eipe h k. Spyrakh, yparxei mia epilejimh frash se ayto to non paper poy leei oti ``gia na dwsoyme mia perissotero anqrwpinh diastash sthn ekdhlwsh qa symmetasxei kai ena sxoleio maqhtwn me eidikes anagkes''. Eseis thn apodokimazete, ws frash, ayth;

ANTWNAROS: Den mporw na apodokimasw to periexomeno enos keimenoy poy den gnwrizw.

POYLIDOY: Na sas feroyme thn efhmerida na to deite.

ANTWNAROS: H efhmerida den einai, kat` anagkh, ajiopisth@

POYLIDOY: Eseis qa apodokimasete ayto poy grafei h efhmerida.

ANTWNAROS: Opws eipa kai prin, oyte epidokimazw, oyte apodokimazw ayta poy grafoyn oi efhmerides. Alimono, an ginw anwtatos kriths twn dhmosieymatwn kaqe hmera stis efhmerides. Ekeino poy sas eipa einai oti h paroysia twn paidiwn kai apo sxoleio poy filojenei paidia me eidikes anagkes, kata thn antilhch ths kybernhshs, einai mia apolyta kalodexoymenh kai epiqymhth -opws prepei na einai apo olh thn ellhnikh koinwnia- paroysia sta stadia. Ayto den apedeije h koinwnia, prin apo ligoys mhnes, otan ginontan edw oi Paraolympiakoi Agwnes; Aytoys toys aqlhtes, toys episkeptes me eidikes anagkes h me problhmata anaphrias, toys agkaliasame, toys filojenhsame, toys eidame san synanqrwpoys mas me ta idia dikaiwmata kai tis idies ypoxrewseis. Toys dwsame thn eykairia na einai parontes, na einai mazi mas.

POYLIDOY: Kanate ena apolyto kai plhres ``rektifie'' ths diatypwshs, thn opoia syzhtoyme edw kai wra. Ejwraizete para poly to epimaxo qema. Edw egine ayth h ekdhlwsh me mia safh politikh skopimothta.

ANTWNAROS: Kata th dikh sas ektimhsh.

POYLIDOY: Etsi diatypwnetai. Den einai ektimhsh. To keimeno einai. Quotation kanoyme edw. Anoigoyme eisagwgika, kleinoyme eisagwgika.

ANTWNAROS: Kata th dikh sas ektimhsh. Oi Ellhnes polites krinoyn thn ekdhlwsh apo ayto poy eidan. Kai sas lew oti yparxoyn para polla sxoleia poy exoyn ekdhlwsei, xwris kamia protroph, aytonoma, me dikh toys prwtoboylia thn prosdokia na einai paronta se paromoies ekdhlwseis sto mellon. Phgainete sta sxoleia kai rwthste.

KOTTARIDHS: Mhpws gnwrizete ean ayto to non paper moirasthke sthn kratikh thleorash, san mpoysoylas, gia th zwntanh thleoptikh kalych ths ekdhlwshs;

ANTWNAROS: Kat` arxas opws sas eipa, den gnwrizw thn yparjh enos tetoioy xartioy. Opote ayto apanta kai sthn erwthsh sas.

SPYRAKH: O Patriarxhs Eirhnaios feretai na exei apodexqei oloys toys oroys poy exei balei h iordanikh pleyra se sxesh me thn entajh sth Synodo Ierarxwn me diabathrio Iordanias. Qelw na rwthsw, ean h kybernhsh qewrei oti aytes oi kinhseis toy Patriarxh kinoyntai pros th swsth kateyqynsh ths ektonwshs ths krishs, eidallws an ektima oti elloxeyei kindynos arabopoihshs toy Patriarxeioy mesw ths kinhshs toy k. Eirhnaioy.

ANTWNAROS: Den exw na prosqesw tipote se osa exoyme pei tis teleytaies hmeres kai o ekproswpos toy Ypoyrgeioy Ejwterikwn kai o k. Roysopoylos kai egw gia to qema toy Patriarxeioy. Ekeino to opoio endiaferei thn ellhnikh Politeia -kai to epanalambanw gia mia akomh fora- einai h diathrhsh twn istorikwn xarakthristikwn toy Patriarxeioy, ena apo ta opoia, poly shmantiko, einai kai o ellhnikos xarakthras toy Patriarxeioy.

SPYRAKH: Edw yparxei kai mia epistolh apo thn allh pleyra poy feretai na apesteilan ierwmenoi ston Prwqypoyrgo poy zhtoyn thn paraithsh toy k. Eirhnaioy. O Prwqypoyrgos exei labei thn epistolh ayth;

ANTWNAROS: Me shmerino ariqmo prwtokolloy parelhfqh to prwi sto politiko grafeio toy Prwqypoyrgoy mia syntomh epistolh toy Mhtropolith Petras, o opoios koinopoiei ston Prwqypoyrgo mia dhlwsh sthn opoia proebhsan, me hmeromhnia 25 Martioy 2005, deka mhtropolites kai arxiepiskopoi poy ypagontai sto Patriarxeio Ierosolymwn.

DHMOSIOGRAFOI: Einai arximandrites.

ANTWNAROS: Gnwrizw ti sas diabazw. Einai mhtropolites kai arxiepiskopoi.

MIXAHL: Meta apo ola ayta, synexizei o k. Eirhnaios na exei thn oikonomikh yposthrijh ths ellhnikhs Politeias;

ANTWNAROS: H ellhnikh Politeia exei topoqethqei sto qema toy Patriarxeioy Ierosolymwn. Epanalambanw, gia mia akomh fora, ayto poy sas eipa kai xqes: H ellhnikh Politeia perimenei oti o k. Eirhnaios, antilambanomenos thn krisimothta ths katastashs, qa arqei sto ycos twn peristasewn kai qa antapokriqei stis istorikes toy eyqynes.

TSIODRAS: Antilambanomai th skopimothta ths dhlwshs ek meroys ths ellhnikhs kybernhshs, omws otan h Ekklhsia ths Elladas eixe ta sygkekrimena problhmata poy htan poly entona, h qesh ths kybernhshs htan teleiws diaforetikh. Htan yper ths aytokaqarshs kai ths mh anameijhs. Sth mia periptwsh, loipon, blepoyme alla metra kai alla staqma gia dyo pragmata poy aforoyn dyo Ekklhsies. Giati;

ANTWNAROS: Giati einai dyo Ekklhsies. Ta pragmata den einai pote to ena idio me to allo.

TSIODRAS: Ara, loipon, den einai qesh arxhs. Periexei politikh skopimothta h mia stash kai h allh. Dhladh, qelw na pw oti h stash apenanti sthn ellhnikh Ekklhsia den einai apo qesh arxhs, alla apo qesh politikhs skopimothtas se sxesh me ta sygkekrimena proswpa.

ANTWNAROS: Qa sas epanalabw gia mia akomh fora oti prokeitai gia dyo diaforetikes periptwseis. Ta xarakthristika toys, oi tropoi leitoyrgias twn Ekklhsiwn, to periballon sto opoio kinoyntai, oi nomoi kai to nomiko plaisio poy diepei th mia kai thn allh periptwsh einai entelws diaforetika.

XIWTHS: Qa hqela na rwthsw, ean h kybernhsh qa apanthsei sthn epistolh poy elabe apo ton Mhtropolith Petras. Epishs, apo th stigmh poy epanalambanete epi treis hmeres thn idia dhlwsh, den katalabainw giati den to lete jekaqara. Zhta h kybernhsh thn paraithsh toy k. Eirhnaioy h oxi;

ANTWNAROS: Oson afora sto prwto skelos ths erwthshs sas: H epistolh aplws koinopoiei mia dhlwsh sthn opoia proebhsan deka ierarxes toy Patriarxeioy Ierosolymwn. Den einai mia epistolh poy anagkastika xrhzei apanthsews. Eikazw oti ayth h dhlwsh exei endexomenws kai alloys paralhptes. Sto deytero erwthma sas, qa moy epitrecete na pw oti h qesh ths ellhnikhs kybernhshs einai safhs. Pera apo osa eipame, den exoyme na prosqesoyme kati allo.

XIWTHS: Apo th stigmh poy h dhlwsh ayth koinopoieitai sto grafeio toy Prwqypoyrgoy, antilambanomaste oloi oti den koinopoieitai mono gia na labei gnwsh h Politeia, alla giati zhta thn parembash ths. To erwthma moy einai, ean protiqetai h kybernhsh na parembei me oloys toys endeiknyomenoys tropoys h an aplws qa parameinei mono stis systaseis poy epanalambanei epi treis hmeres.

ANTWNAROS: Sas epanalambanw gia pollosth fora oti to Patriarxeio Ierosolymwn diepetai apo nomiko plaisio kai kanones poy orizontai kai efarmozontai ektos ths ellhnikhs Epikrateias. Qa hqela, epishs, na sas pw oti h epistolh twn deka ierarxwn toy Patriarxeioy Ierosolymwn exei hmeromhnia 25 Martioy 2005. H ellhnikh kybernhsh topoqethqhke xwris na exei gnwsh ayths ths epistolhs, h opoia, opws sas eipa, efqase shmera. Allwste, h epistolh poy th synodeyei exei hmeromhnia 30 Martioy. Mporei, loipon, kapoios na diapistwsei th xronikh seira twn qematwn. Dhladh, prohghqhke h dhlwsh, h opoia den eixe perielqei se gnwsh ths ellhnikhs kybernhshs kai h ellhnikhs kybernhsh topoqethqhke meta. Fantazomai oti kai oi ierarxes toy Patriarxeioy Ierosolymwn qa exoyn labei gnwsh ths topoqethshs ths ellhnikhs Politeias.

KAKALHS: Thn prwth hmera ths ejaggelias twn forologikwn metrwn, o Kybernhtikos Ekproswpos dhlwse oti den yparxei prwto kai deytero paketo. Ayta einai ta metra. Xqes, o k. Alogoskoyfhs eipe oti den yparxoyn teleytaia metra sth forologia. Giati h kybernhsh den leei eyqews oti qa akoloyqhsoyn allepallhla kymata forologikwn epidromwn, mexris otoy to epiqymei;

ANTWNAROS: Kat` arxas, den yparxei kamia forologikh epidromh. Deyteron, isxyei apolytws h dhlwsh sthn opoia proebh o k. Roysopoylos se ayth edw thn aiqoysa.

KAKALHS: @Ara, den isxyei h dhlwsh toy k. Alogoskoyfh;

ANTWNAROS: Isxyei h dhlwsh poy ekane o k. Roysopoylos. O k. Alogoskoyfhs eipe ta idia pragmata.

GKOYTZANHS: Na sas qymisw ti eipe o k. Roysopoylos; Eipe oti ta metra ayta einai arketa gia na antimetwpistei to elleimma kai na perioristei katw apo to 3%. Den apanthse sto an qa lhfqoyn kai alla metra. Mporei na lhfqoyn metra, oxi gia to elleimma, alla endexomenws gia kapoio allo logo.

ANTWNAROS: O k. Roysopoylos rwthqhke gia prwto h deytero paketo kai apanthse oti den yparxei deytero, trito h allo paketo. Ayta einai ta metra.

KAKALHS: O k. Alogoskoyfhs omws epanhlqe xqes kai eipe oti den yparxoyn teleytaia metra sth forologia. @Afhse anoixto to endexomeno na yparjoyn kai nea forologika metra to epomeno diasthma.

ANTWNAROS: Epanalambanw gia mia akoma fora oti exoyme thn pepoiqhsh pws ayta ta metra, efarmozomena opws prepei na efarmostoyn, qa mas odhghsoyn ston teliko stoxo, o opoios einai safhs.

XIWTHS: Qelw na sas qesw ena erwthma poy einai kai ligo proswpiko. Se dhmosieymata kai se sxolia diabasa xqes mia frash poy leei oti h kybernhsh ekfrazetai merikes fores me atexna diatypwmena epixeirhmata, eite me cellismata atalantwn ekproswpwn ths. Qewreite oti sas afora proswpika;

ANTWNAROS: Oxi.

XONDROS: Poion afora; Giati oi Ekproswpoi einai dyo.

ANTWNAROS: Sas eipa na rwthsete toys syntaktes twn dhmosieymatwn poy epikaleiste.

GKOYTZANHS: Yparxei mia diastash se ayto, oti ekeinoi oi opoioi kanoyn thn kritikh einai o legomenos filokybernhtikos Typos.

ANTWNAROS: E, kai; Qa toys afairesoyme to dikaiwma na askoyn kritikh;

GKOYTZANHS: Fysika, oxi. Apla, rwtw an ayto problhmatizei thn kybernhsh. Einai dynaton, kyrie Ekproswpe, emeis oi dhmosiografoi na poyme oti qa prepei na afaireqei to dikaiwma kritikhs apo toys dhmosiografoys; Pros Qeoy!

ANTWNAROS: Sas diabebaiw, loipon, oti stoys 8-9 mhnes poy eimai s` ayth th qesh, antimetwpizw synhqws me xamogelo thn kritikh poy moy askeitai kai tis epishmanseis poy ginontai. Exoyme mia kaqhmerinh zymwsh, diergasia, antallagh apocewn. Einai fysiko na exoyn polloi apo toys paristamenoys -kai oxi mono aytoi- diaforetikes apoceis ws pros to pws prepei na ginei kati, pws prepei na eipwqei kati, pws qa htan kalytera na eipwqei. Alla ayto den to eisprattw ws proswpikh aixmh, epeidh ep` aytoy erwthqhka.

TSIODRAS: Wstoso, qewreite oti prepei na allajoyn kapoia pragmata sthn epikoinwniakh politikh; Giati, bebaiws, diabazete thn kritikh, qelw na jerw an th diabazete aplws, an aplws xamogelate h an thn pairnete kai ypoch.

ANTWNAROS: H kybernhsh kanei mia xara th doyleia ths. Sas to eipa kai prohgoymenws kai to epanalambanw.

Sas eyxaristw. Kalo Sabbatokyriako.

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